I liked it better when "Tiger, Tiger" was something mysterious & everytime someone said it, it meant something secret & obscure. Now it's just the "code word" for some rebel cop group, and why the hell are they just NOW tossing it around everywhere to each other. You'd think through the course of the seasons it would have popped up more often... just sayin.
This theory is long, so bear with me. However, I am going to start by saying
this: I must admit, I actually don’t
want it to turn out that Stiles is Red John.
Ever since the show started I have envisioned in my mind Red
John as being middle aged in his 40’s, with a younger looking face – deceptive given
his true demeanor… Quirky personality somewhat similar to Patrick’s in the
sense that he finds pleasure and amusement in everything he does – the difference
with Red John being his pleasure comes from murdering others… Almost light in a
sense, like Patrick a joker, but with the ability to turn into a monster. Physically not imposing, sly, clever, and
quick as fox to get himself in and out of anywhere as quickly and silently as possible…
Which is why Stiles to me would actually come as a
disappointment. I personally find him too
old to be Red John. He’s too stern. Too haughty.
He doesn’t “blend” as well as I envisioned Red John doing. He’s almost too obvious. However, this is a completely subjective opinion,
and I am sure many people would love to see the cult leader be revealed as Red
Jon, and I must admit everything is pointing to good ol’ Bret.
For starters, his personality fits what Red John’s has developed
into over the show almost perfectly.
Both Red John and Stiles are charismatic, deceptive, master
manipulators, and cruelly smart. In
fact, Stiles is about the only one who is able to use his own intelligence,
manipulations, and charisma to give Patrick a run for his money.
As we have seen, Red John is able to coerce almost anybody into
doing his dirty work. Even… brainwash
them, perhaps? This is right up Stiles’
alley with him at the Helm of his creepy Visualize cult that does pretty much
exactly that – brainwash its followers.
He has the power, money, and skill to gather such a huge collection of ‘disciples’
with an equally powerful, wealthy, and manipulative organization behind him to
back him up. It would be easy to see how
someone of Stiles’ magnitude could operate such an organization that Red John
does with such dedicated followers.
Recall back to the pivotal episode where Ms. Martins let the
cat out of the proverbial bag by inadvertently telling Patrick something along
the lines of “You’re just like him.” And “I’m amazed the two of you didn’t
become best friends.”. Well, call me
crazy, but Stiles is the only person on Patrick’s suspect list that is anywhere
close to Patrick’s own personality. And given
the fact that they are so similar, I am surprised as well that the two aren’t
best buds. Now, is it possible that Red
John is someone completely different who is just able to change his personality
into something different when interacting with Patrick? Absolutely.
And given the twists and turns of the show, and also the cleverness of
Red John, this isn’t an unlikely possibility.
However, Stiles certainly fits what Lorelei had to say about the two of
them.
Continuing on, let’s take a look at a statement from one of
the show’s former writers, Ashley Gable.
She stated that we have to look at Red John as a “where’s Waldo” figure;
someone who is in the background. Well,
a quick hop onto The Mentalist Wiki brought me to this page: (http://thementalist.wikia.com/wiki/Where's_Waldo)
where this Waldo theory is expanded a little further. The main thing I want to point out here is
the presence of a Waldo like individual in the season three finale –
Strawberries and Cream part two. Take a
look at this video clip (the final sequence where Patrick shoots Timothy
Carter) : (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IiWoXZn-gH8)
and pay particular attention to a man in a red top with black pants and a dark
ball cap chatting to one of the employees at the café in the mall. Perhaps it’s just me, but I believe this man
looks like Sties. I can see short white
hair from the back of the ball cap, which is the exact hairstyle Stiles has,
and this person certainly fulfills the “where’s Waldo” thing. He also appears to be a bit older, fitting
Stiles again. Now continue watching to
the very end, and you will see this same man running at the end after Patrick
has shot Carter. He appears when the two
security guards are approaching Patrick, and the man can be seen running in a
slightly crouched position behind Patrick by the escalators. Again, to me, this looks like Stiles. Particularly the way he is running – I would
not expect an older gentleman like Stiles to be doing a full sprint – more of a
run like what we see the mystery man doing.
As I have previously stated, I do not really want to see
Stiles revealed as Red John, however there is certainly some good evidence
pointing towards him. As another note,
what an irony it would be if Stiles was revealed to be Red John, as if I recall
correctly, in a very early episode Patrick actually said about Stiles that he “would
never hurt a fly.”
As one final thing I noticed, we also have to remember that
The Mentalist is and always has been a TV show. The producers of the show had no idea how long
it would last – maybe ten seasons, maybe two seasons – and therefore they
probably had to pick somebody to be Red John during those first couple seasons to
cover their backsides in case the program went south and they had to wrap it up
sooner than expected. Many of the
suspects on Patrick’s list were introduced in later seasons. Stiles was introduced in Season Two. Pretty early on. Just yet another observation.
The one thing that doesn’t work with Stiles
is the voice that we have heard Red John talking in. I myself would not like to brag, but I am
pretty good with putting on accents and changing my voice (I do so frequently
in theatre and film productions). I find
it hard to believe how we go from Stile’s rough and gruff slightly
British-accented voice to Red John’s high-pitched, smooth falsetto. Now, perhaps Red John uses some sort of voice
changing software. After all, we have
only heard him on the phone and under a mask where he could have hidden a voice
changer device. Well, not quite. Recall back to the episode where Red John
sends the little girl to Patrick in the cemetery. When Patrick reveals what the girl said about
Red John, he says that she told him the man had an “odd voice”. This would certainly describe the creepy high
pitched Red John voice, but this would mean no voice changing devices could
have been used as he talked face to face with the girl. However, the girl could be saying that Stiles’
gruff sounding voice was odd as well, debunking this idea.
I realise that was a lot, but I think there are some things there that definitely point towards Stiles. Regardless, it will be exciting to see what the 'big reveal' will bring, and this has been a great season so far.
To be honest I'm none the bloody wiser after last weeks episode. If there is a secret society which seems to be rife within law enforcement we are assuming of the CBI at least Lisbon, Cho, Rigsby and Van Pelt are clean. Stands to reason if the Red John case was being looked after by a group of clean cops RJ would want to be close not only watching what they know but also getting his jollies off watching them fail.
Surely in order to be involved or rather control something so unwieldy he would need to command respect amongst law enforcement. Potential peers perhaps?
Ah well. Best I can come up with.
As many theories here said, I also hope that RJ and the "Tyger, Tyger" groups are separate things, it would be a massive anti climax if RJ wasn't a specific person and a group. I also want RJ to be against the "Tyger, Tyger". However, I have a feeling that PJ is playing a trick with the list. Firstly, he told Lisbon about it, he knows perfectly well that it would put her in danger and all the people she tells (PJ knows she will). I predict that PJ will find RJ soon enough, however, he will be faced with a choice, kill RJ or accept his help and take down the "Tyger, Tyger" group. I reckon he will take them down and kill RJ later. I also think RJ is being made into a more or less sympathetic villain by Heller, for example RJ helping PJ in season 2 (I think, when PJ was tied to the chair). Also the numerous times RJ was trying to reach in to PJ and make him his friend. I for one, am really excited about the prospect of PJ and RJ teaming up for a little, the "Tyger, Tyger" group should be no problem for the 2 of them. We can see that RJ already started to take out some of the members of the "Tyger, Tyger" group by killing Partridge. I also think that the everyone on the list bar Kirkland and RJ are members of the "Tyger, Tyger" group. Haffner is my choice for RJ, he fits the descriptions and seems clever enough to be RJ + he works privately now, unlike the majority of suspects who work for the law enforcement.
Nobody has said anything about this...Imdb still had him cared all the way through the red john episode. So obviously he's not getting killed off...interesting?
I know you're itching to thumbs down, but indulge me for a moment. This is a follow-up to my previous post (7168) about BP being alive and happily feeding pigeons on a park bench while wearing his favorite bracelet/watch: http://i.imgur.com/6Ez7I0R.jpg (Image is NOT mine, please let me know who made it so I can give you credit for it, because you rock).
I'd like to respond to the "Heller/Plotnick insist he's dead and they would never lie to us" contingent. Producers and actors lie all the time about this exact same thing. Then they try to get off on incredibly lame technicalities. If you haven't seen the new Battlestar Gallactica from a few years ago, skip the next paragraph because it will spoil the crud out of you. As far as I can tell, you can't hide spoilers on this page.
****Spoiler: Remember when Starbuck "died"? Starbuck fans wailed and gnashed their teeth all summer long, but I didn't believe it for a second. The producers and Katee Sackhoff just went on and on and on about how she was really dead and would never come back--they protested a bit too much. Then, lo and behold, Starbuck wanders back in a few episodes later. She looks like/acts like/has the same genes and memories as Starbuck, and is absolutely convinced that she's Starbuck. Then we discover during the finale that she was one of those creepy angel-type people who was completely indistinguishable (even on a genetic level) from Starbuck. It was an incredibly lame stunt. But we swallowed it without much fuss because we were too busy trying to choke down the turdburger that was the rest of the series finale. But I digress.*****End Spoiler
If you think Heller and his merry band of goons would never mislead you, then I fear that life will bring you many disappointments. Personally, I HATE BP as a suspect. He sucks--HARD. He just happens to suck a tiny bit less than the rest of the losers on the suspect list (Why, Bruno, why??????). I'm not going to go into the various reasons he could be Red John, because they've been done ad nauseam. I can put it in the comments on request. My point is that this photo is pretty good evidence that BP is still alive. And if he's still alive, he's the best fit for Red John out of this disappointing bunch.
I'd be thrilled if it turned out that RJ isn't someone on the list (although I'd probably want to punch Heller in the face). My personal pick has always been Ellis Mars ("He is mar" = "El es Mar..." plus the actor is awesome). Tons of people would make a better RJ than Partridge. Unless it's the newly-revealed Michael Kirkland--if it is, I'll probably spend several days vomiting out of rage and disgust.
So just look at the photo and tell me honestly if you think it's Partridge on that bench. Because I think it is.
Regarding the 7 suspects, I feel we know far less than we have been led to believe and think we know. I have always had major problems imagining any of the 7 as RJ--none of them is a credible RJ! I also continue to have problems believing J would so easily reveal his true list to anyone. If J really believed knowing the list would put someone in danger, I think he never would have told Lisbon regardless what she wanted. J could not survive another murder equivalent to the murder of his family. --By now, he has known Lisbon and the others nearly as long as he was married to Angela. Further, the CBI team has saved each others' lives--not just your ordinary workplace relationships! So, Mr. Heller has his work cut out for him if RJ will be one of the 7 suspects revealed at the end of S5/S6E1.
Further, the method by which J came up with the 7 final names seems both fallible and very atypical for him--a brute-force approach. The whole thing hinges on Lorelei's statement, "It's a wonder the two of you didn't become lifelong friends the moment you shook hands!" That was the basis for the 3 criteria stated in the episodes:
#1. J and RJ shook hands
#2. They shook hands AFTER J's family was murdered
#3. RJ must be someone who could have been at all of the RJ murders
Re. #1: This directly hinges on the truthfulness of Lorelei's statement. (I think) J made the point that Lorelei said it in a heated conversation rather than a calm, thoughtful moment. It seems reasonable the statement is true. But note how LITTLE it actually excludes. J and RJ could have become friends later. J and RJ could have shaken hands many times. They could have shaken hands at any time--before the murder of J's family, or, indeed, before RJ became RJ (started murdering!).
Re. #2: Assuming J shook hands with RJ AFTER J's family was murdered is plausible, but not necessary logically. This opens up the possibility of the J-RJ connection extending back to J's early days. The person who became RJ could have known and disliked J before J's family was murdered. J's TV comments then could have triggered the murder of his family. Or, someone like Sean Barlow could have had a grudge against Alex Jane and taken revenge by attacking J and his family. (Remember Judge Dellinger's point: "If you want to hurt a man, don't kill him. Kill his family.") A Sean Barlow could easily have predicted that, as a psychic, J would work with police and comment on notorious murderers for the credibility and free publicity. Either the murderer might attack J or his family, or, Barlow could have them murdered in the RJ style, certain that the serial killer would be blamed. Finally, J could have known RJ before RJ became a murderer and shaken his hand then. Shaking hands need not have anything to do with RJ killing J's family.
Re. #3: It is an assumption that RJ personally committed all of his murders. But what if he had a follower commit some murders in his style? Then the whole methodology falls apart. Further, there have been several cases of copycat RJ murders. J would have to identify the actual RJ murders with 100% accuracy.
Further, it isn't credible that J wouldn't use everything at his disposal to whittle down a list of 2,000+ people. He already admitted to eliminating women. What about other characteristics? Disability: Could RJ be blind, rely on a wheelchair, or be weakened by disease (e.g., advanced MS, for instance)? What about age--too young, too old? And how does the Red Barn RJ-style murders change that criterion? Would a famous face (e.g., TV star, important politician) eliminate someone from being RJ because he would be too identifiable?
Finally, I think the fans who have tried to use physical descriptions are on a fool's errand. First is the question of whether all physical descriptions are of the same RJ person (vs. RJ and one or more disciples). I put no faith in Rosalind Harker's description. She is blind (we believe), but the bigger concern is whether she can be trusted, being that she's in love with Roy Tagliaferro. Anyhow, physical characteristics are subject to change, especially over a long period (12+ years since the Orville Tanner RJ murder). A person can gain/lose a lot of weight, and become much more or much less physically fit. People may bald with age and balding people can use ointments to stimulate new hair growth. Hair can be cut, straightened or curled. People may go from a middle-aged appearance to definitely old over a 12 year period. People can be ambidextrous. How someone smells can change based on where they are currently living and what they are doing (construction project vs. city job). Callused hands can become soft if you stop doing heavy physical work. And people may even lose height with age (shrinking an inch is fairly common). In short, I think the physical characteristics must be used very gingerly if at all. Gender and significant differences in height--several inches, for instance--may be useful, but the rest is questionable.
Taking the J character as presented for the past 5 years, as presented, the list of suspects and methodology are both highly suspect. If I had my druthers, Walter Mashburn would be an excellent RJ (worst part of it is I liked Mashburn--horrible thought!). If I am FORCED to choose among the list of 7 suspects, it would be either Bret Stiles-plus-son/protege OR Sheriff McAllister.